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PZC Minutes 100191PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES October 1, 1991 Page 9 of 14 Worksession On Guidelines For Approvins Asohaftt-5hinales in, WiIdridce considering that. There are a number of products other than asphalt roofs that are more fire resistant than wood shakes and nobody has proposed them because they are more expensive. Concrete roof tiles are what he is suggesting. There are lightweight concrete roof tile product that simulates the shape and color of a wood shake and does not significantly add to the weight so you do not have to beef up the structure. It is only about 15% more expensive than a wood shake and has a fifty year guarantee and is fireproof. He suggests that this is an economic issue. It has certainly some merit in terms of function and durability, etc., but it is an economically motiviated request. He stated he appreciated where Mr. Kelly is coming from. He stated he is here to remind every one that he didn't make up these rules, but he was aware of them when he built his house and he abided by them. Every property owner that purchases property in Wildridge, if they look at the title repc-t, is subject to the covenants. You promise to every neighbor up there that you will abide by those covenants. That is fact. He feels that people are obligated to abide by the covenants. If asphalt roofs are such a great idea sombody should go to the trouble of changing the covenants. That what it takes to make them legally acceptable, or you can ignore those covenants, and you have the right to do that. He stated that there are 32 or more units currently under construction that will come pouring in here asking for an asphalt roof. In the last year and a half you have said no to about 15 projects that requested asphalt roofs. They will have a legitimate gripe with the Town and the Commission. He doesn't think that they would ever see a wood shake roof in Wildridge again. He stated that he talked to an appraiser recently and asked which would be appraised at a higher value, asphalt roofs or wood shakes, and he said wood shakes. It is a perceived value. It is aesthetic. There is a minimum development standard that was anticipated by the developer of Wildridge eroded into the covenants which said wood shakes is the minimum visual aesthetic standard in Wildridge. There are products that simulate that look that have been used, woodruf shingles or the concrete tile he mentioned. Aesthetically they meet the goal, economically ones cheaper, ones got better warranty and is more expensive. To solve the problem of creating options, some of which may be more economically desirable, some which might be more fire resistant, does not have to involve asphalt roofs. He believes that if the Commission approves asphalt roofing products, they will be diminish the value of his property. When he goes to sell his property the bank will only lend as PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES October 1, 1991 Page 10 of 14 Worksession on Guidelines For Approving Asphalt Shingles In Wildridge much as the appraiser says it is worth. The appraiser will be looking for comparables and if the only comparables available are asphalt roof products the appraiser will appraise it less than if they had wood shakes. If your considering asphalt roofs, then your messing with property values. The covenants are in force. They cannot be waived, and they do not go away until 88 years from now. That is fact and if the overwhelming majority of people who own property up there want asphalt roofs, seventy-five percent of them have to say yes to them. Until that happens they are illegal. He stated that he has a problem with this situation. The Commission has gone through worksessions and came to a conclusion which was to be the decision for a long time. If there is new information, or a new product, or something that has changed since that conclusion was reached, talk about it. He stated that one of the reasons that he was attracted to Wildridge was the covenants. He could count on minimum development standards. He could count on his neighbor following the same rules as he did. He feels this is really a problem. Rick Pylman gave the Commission a letter from Dave Peel, a member of the Eagle -Vail design review board, relating how they handled this type of matter. Clayton McRory stated that the Commission should get on with looking at the products under consideration. The applicants provided all the samples for the Commission's review. Discussion followed on the policing of the application of the roofing material to make sure the correct weight and texture is installed. Discussion followed on the various weights and textures and warranties of each sample. Discussion followed on how to define the guideline for the texture and shadow and relief. Rick Pylman stated that if someone comes in with a request for an asphalt roof and it is on a house that the Commission feels has the type of architecture that doesn't bear an asphalt roof, then the Commission has the right to say that this would not be an jappropriate mix of materials. The Commission decided that the final guidelines for approval of an asphalt roof are: 300 lb. minimum weight product; it should have a relief and shadow and color variation pattern. Chairman Perkins then called the meeting back to order. He stated that he was prepared for a motion on Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge, Bruce Kelly Residence. PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES October 1, 1991 Page 11 of 14 Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Subdivision. ,Bruce Kelly Single Family Residence, Design Revisions•. (cont) Sue Railton moved to grant final design revisions approval to Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge, for the color changes requested and the textured fiberglass shingle, the Oak Ridge Shadow in the adobe color in a 300 lb minimum weight. Discussion followed on the color of the asphalt shingle. Patti Dixon seconded the motion. The request was denied with a 3 to 3 vote, with John Perkins, Henry Vest and Derek Pysher voting nay. A second motion was made by Derek Pysher to separate out and approve the requested color changes. Sue Railton seconded and the motion carried unanimously. John Perkins stated that he voted no on the asphalt shingles because it is his personal feeling that it is more appropriate to have a wood roof on a log home. Lot 57, Block 3. Wildridge Subdivision, Jan Livery (Lod Single Family Residence. Material Change Request, Design Review Rick Pylman stated that Jan Livergood received a final design approval on February 8, 1991. One condition of that approval was that woodruf shingles be used. The applicant is now requesting a change from a woodruf shingle to an asphalt shingle. The applicant will present the exact sample of roofing material she would like to use. She stated that the Timberline Ultra has a 40 year warranty, 400 lb. per square and it has the look of slate. Discussion on the texture and weight and the type of building it will be installed on followed. Jack Hunn stated that he feels that there should be a range of colors that would be allowed. Clayton McRory asked if they could add to the guidelines that were set up that they fall within the same color scheme that a shake roof may give within a certain amount of years. A darker brown, etc. To keep a continuity in color throughout. Sue Railton moved to grant material change request for Lot 57, Block 3, Wildridge. The roof to be used is to be Timberline Ultra, 40 year, Birchwood color, minimum 300 lb per square. Clayton MCRory seconded. PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES October 1, 1991 Page 12 of 14 Lot 57, Block 3. Wildridge Subdivision, Jan Livergood Single Family Residence, Material Change Request. (cont) Derek Pysher stated that he has a hard time with the controls and with the product, and he wants to uphold the standards of the subdivision and make sure that the highest quality materials are put up there. Chairman Perkins called for a vote and the motion carried 4 to 2, with Derek Pysher and John Perkins voting nay. Chairman Perkins stated that they would now go to other business so that they can go back to the previous request. Clayton McRory moved to go back to Lot 65, Block 3, Wildridge for further discussion. Sue Railton seconded, and the motion carried 5 to 1, with John Perkins voting nay. Further discussion followed on the color of the proposed roof and if the applicant would want to change the color of the proposed roof color the Board would again vote. The applicant reviewed the reasoning for his choice of adobe stating that it was to keep it the basic color of a wood shake roof. He stated that he did not feel that the dark color that a shake roof turns to is attractive. AS far as the house being log, if you consider the history of log homes, most of them had metal roofs, which is also not allowed in Wildridge. The applicant stated that he would change the color to a teak color. Clayton McRory moved to accept the material change for the Bruce Kelly residence, Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge, with the teak colored asphalt shingle. Sue Railton seconded. The request was again denied with a vote of 3 to 3, with John Perkins, Henry Vest and Derek Pysher voting nay. Buz Reynolds returned as a voting member of the Commission. Chairman Perkins asked for any other buisness. Rick Pylman stated that John Dunham and Tad Degen, representing the Wahl fourplex project are here to discuss the approved roofing of this project. He stated that the applicant is more than willing to use the woodruf product, however there is a building code problem. On a duplex or a townhouse project where there is a property line separating units there is a demand for a greater fire protection. When we first started using this product, the masonite corporation did manufacture a chemically treated woodruf, that combined with some metal fittings gave the class B fire rating that is required for a duplex or a townhouse project. he stated that he talked to the masonite corporation today and because of poor market PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES October 1, 1991 Page 13 of 14 Other Business (cont demand for that product they have stooped makinq that product. Woodruf no longer has a product that will meet building code standards for duplexes and townhouses. It will work in a single family home where you do not have a property line issue. This project is in construction. They have a problem with the building code and because of that he told them that they could come to the meeting with short notice. They were willing to put the woodruf on, but we can't let them do that. Their request is to go to an asphalt shingle. They will go along with what ever is allowed. John Dunham stated that he got a call on Monday saying that the product ordered is no longer available. He stated that they would like to go to a synthetic roof. He provided colors of the townhomes and stated that they would acquiesce to whatever color of roof the Commission would wish. They are about 25% complete without roofs. Discussion followed on whether this is applicable to duplexes and if it is what problems will be upcoming. Anyone that doesn't have a roof on now won't be able to use the product if there is a property line involved. It could be only on tri-plexes and up that a type B roof is required. Considerable discussion followed on this matter. Jack Hunn suggested that the applicant consider wood shaKes. which he feels would be a step up instead of down grading. The applicant stated that they have pre -sold and have to stay within their limits. Sue Railton moved to grant Lot 83, Block 1, Wildridge the change from woodruf to a textured asphalt shingle, in a darker tone brown, minimum 3001b per square. Henry Vest seconded. The motion carried 5 to 2 with John Perkins and Derek Pysher voting nay. Rick Pylman stated that the Town's Townhouse Project also has Woodruf as an approved roofing material and they will not be able to utilize that either. He stated that he is not, at this time, ready to make a presentation, but they will be back with a request at a future meeting. Reading and Approval of Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting of September 17, 1991 Derek Pysher moved to approve the minutes of the September 17, 1991 meeting as submitted. Sue Railton seconded and the motion carried unanimously. PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES October 1, 1991 Page 14 of 14 Rick Pylman asked if the Commission had any comments to make regarding the Streetscape to call him within the next couple days. The meeting was adjourned at 9:30 PM. Respectfully submitted, Charlette Pascuzzi Recording Secretary Commission approval J. Perkins S. Railton C. McRory A. Reynolds P. Dixon H. Vest D. Pysher Town of Avon P. O. Boa 975, Avon, CO 81620 (303) 9494280 October 17, 1991 Mr. Bruce Kelly 4192 Spruce Way Apt 102 Vail, CO 81657 RE: Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Subdivision Color Design Review Dear Mr. Kelly Thank you for your presentation to the Planning and Zoning Commission on October 15, 1991. The Commission approved the color of the asphalt roof as ,eathered wood, and also approved the color change for the doors ans windows trim to a Cabot Stain solid beechwood Grey #0542, and a Cabot Stain Semi -Transparent Dark Grey #0347 for the fascia. Please do not hesitate to contact this office should you have any questions. Sincerely, Charlette Pascuzzi Recording Secretary Copy/File PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING October 15, 1991 Lot 63, Block 3, Yildridge Subdivision, Bruce Kelly Residence The Commission approved the color of the asphalt roof as weathered wood, and also approved the color change for the doors and windows trim to a Cabot Stain solid Beechwood Grey #0542, and a Cabot Stain Semi -transparent Dark Grey #0347 for the fascia. M E M 0 TO: William D. James, Town Manager FROM: Rick Pylman, Director of Community Development DATE: October 3, 1991 RE: Bruce Kelly Appeal of Design Review Decision At the Planninq and Zoning Commission meeting of October 1, 1991, Mr. Bruce Kelly requested several material and color changes for his residence, currently under construction at 4281 Wildridge Road West. Please refer to the attached memo to the Planning and Zoning Commission for details. The Planning and Zoning Commission voted to approve the requested color changes, but in a 3 - 3 vote denied the request to substitute asphalt shingles for the previously wood shake roof. Two of the Commission members voting against the motion to approve stated that Mr. Kelly had selected a strong architectural style by building a log home and that an asphalt roof was inappropriate to that style. The third stated that he felt the Commission should abide by the Wildridge Covenants which prohibit asphalt shingles. Box 975, Avon, CO 81620 (303) 9493280 October 4, 1991 Mr. Bruce Kelly 4192 Spruce Way, Apt 102 Vail, CO 81657 RE: Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Design Changes Request Dear Mr. Kelly: Thank you for your presentation to the Planning and Zoning Commission on October 1, 1991. The Commission took the following actions regarding your requests: The Commission granted approval to the color changes requested, 1. e. changing the log color from silver oak to almond aspen and the trim to a tan color. The Commission denied your request for a change of roofing material from cedar shakes to asphalt shingles. I realize that you have already filed an appeal with the Town Clerk and are scheduled to appear before the Town Council on October 8, 1991. I am, however required to provide you with the procedure for filing an appeal to the Town Council, as taken from the Planning and Zoning Commission Design Procedures, Rules and Regulations. Section 10.00 - Appeal to the Town Council: 10.10 - A decision of the Planning and Zoning Commission may be appealed to the Town Council by the applicant or any aggrieved person or at the request of the Mayor at any time before the decision becomes final. 10.20 - Not more than thirty days following the filing of an appeal, the Town Council shall review the action of the Planning and Zoning Commission. The Town Council shall, in writing, confirm, modify or reverse the decision of the Commission within thirty days following the commencement of review. October 4, 1991 Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Design Changes Request Page 2 If it deems insufficient information is available to provide the basis for a sound decision, the Town Council may postpone final action for not more than thirty additional days. failure of the Council to act within thirty additional days shall be deemed a granting of the approval unless the applicant consents to a time extension. 10.30 - Any decision by the Town Council which results in disapproval of the Planning and Zoning Commission decision shall specifically describe the reason for disapproval. Please do not hesitate to contact this office should you have any questions. Sincerely. S Charlette Pascuzzi Recording Secretary Copy/file M E M 0 TO: William D. James, Town Manager FROM: Rick Pylman, Director of Community Development DATE: October 3, 1991 RE: Bruce Kelly Appeal of Design Review Decision At the Planning and Zoning Commission meeting of October 1, 1991, Mr. Bruce Kelly requested several material and color changes for his residence, currently under construction at 4281 Wildridge Road West. Please refer to the attached memo to the Planning and Zoning Commission for details. The Planning and Zoning Commission voted to approve the requested color changes, but in a 3 - 3 vote denied the request to substitute asphalt shingles for the previously wood shake roof. Two of the Commission members voting against the motion to approve stated that Mr. Kelly had selected a strong architectural style by building a log home and that an asphalt roof was inappropriate to that style. The third stated that he felt the Commission should abide by the Wildridge Covenants which prohibit asphalt shingles. STAFF REPORT TO THE PLANNING AND -40NING COMMISSION October 1, 1991 Lot 63, Block 3, Wild n dge Subdivision Bruce Kelly Single Family Residence Design Revisions On June 5, 1990, Bruce Kelly received final design approval for a single family residence. The original approval was for a two story building with a gable roof. Approved exterior building materials were 10" diameter peeled and stained logs (silver oak) with mortar white chinking and window trim, cedar shake shingles and all foundations covered with wnite stucco. On April 2, 1991, the applicant receiveo approval for architectural changes to the roof form and window/door placements and also a change in the siting or the buliding to allow for a shorter access drive to the house. Mr. Kelly is now requesting the following revisions: A change from cedar shake shingles to: 1st Alternative: A textured fiberglass shingle, i.e., (a) Owen Corning "Oakridge Shadow" (b) Heritage 30 from Tamko 2nd Alternative: A woodruf shingle The color to be rustic cedar or weathered wood. The applicant cites fire safety, lifespar, cost efficiency and long range appearance as his reasoning for this reauesc. 2. Change original silver oak log stain to an a;mono aspen (lighter colors, and change the «:ndow trim from mortar white to a blue/green. Tne chlnrsn9 and stucco will remain white. The applicant feels the silver oak color was too dark and didn't leave the natural look and grain of the ogs to snow through. The almond aspen is a silver color, but much lighter and doesn't cover the naturalness or the logs. The window trim needs to be a darker color to give more contrast with the log color. Samples will be Drought o the meeting. STAFF REPORT TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION October 1, 1991 Page 2 of 2 Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Subdivision Bruce Kelly Single Family Residence Design Revisions STAFF COMMENTS It has been the policy of the Planning and Zoning Commission. in the past, to allow only cedar shake shingles, tile. woodruf shi-ngles, or sod in the Wild m dge Subdivision. STAFF RECOMMENDATION Review and discussion of proposed color and roof material changes. RECOMMENDED ACTION 1. Presentation of Application 2. Applicant's Presentation 5. Commission Review 6. Commission Action Respe fully_--LubmitteQ, Rick Pylman Director of Community Development PLANNING AND ZONING ACTION Approved as submitted 1 i Approved witn Rec.mmencec Conditions ( ) Approved with Modified Conditions i Continued( ) Demed ( ) Withdr o`` Date `1Patti Dixon, Secret With a unanimous vote the Commission granted approval to the color changes requested, however with a 3 to 3 vote they denied the request to change the roofing material from wood shake to asphalt.