PZC Minutes 100191PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
October 1, 1991
Page 9 of 14
Worksession On Guidelines For Approvins Asohaftt-5hinales in,
WiIdridce
considering that. There are a number of products other than
asphalt roofs that are more fire resistant than wood shakes
and nobody has proposed them because they are more expensive.
Concrete roof tiles are what he is suggesting. There are
lightweight concrete roof tile product that simulates the
shape and color of a wood shake and does not significantly
add to the weight so you do not have to beef up the
structure. It is only about 15% more expensive than a wood
shake and has a fifty year guarantee and is fireproof. He
suggests that this is an economic issue. It has certainly
some merit in terms of function and durability, etc., but it
is an economically motiviated request. He stated he
appreciated where Mr. Kelly is coming from. He stated he is
here to remind every one that he didn't make up these rules,
but he was aware of them when he built his house and he
abided by them. Every property owner that purchases property
in Wildridge, if they look at the title repc-t, is subject
to the covenants. You promise to every neighbor up there
that you will abide by those covenants. That is fact. He
feels that people are obligated to abide by the covenants.
If asphalt roofs are such a great idea sombody should go to
the trouble of changing the covenants. That what it takes to
make them legally acceptable, or you can ignore those
covenants, and you have the right to do that. He stated that
there are 32 or more units currently under construction that
will come pouring in here asking for an asphalt roof. In the
last year and a half you have said no to about 15 projects
that requested asphalt roofs. They will have a legitimate
gripe with the Town and the Commission. He doesn't think
that they would ever see a wood shake roof in Wildridge
again. He stated that he talked to an appraiser recently and
asked which would be appraised at a higher value, asphalt
roofs or wood shakes, and he said wood shakes. It is a
perceived value. It is aesthetic. There is a minimum
development standard that was anticipated by the developer of
Wildridge eroded into the covenants which said wood shakes is
the minimum visual aesthetic standard in Wildridge. There
are products that simulate that look that have been used,
woodruf shingles or the concrete tile he mentioned.
Aesthetically they meet the goal, economically ones cheaper,
ones got better warranty and is more expensive.
To solve the problem of creating options, some of which may
be more economically desirable, some which might be more fire
resistant, does not have to involve asphalt roofs. He
believes that if the Commission approves asphalt roofing
products, they will be diminish the value of his property.
When he goes to sell his property the bank will only lend as
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
October 1, 1991
Page 10 of 14
Worksession on Guidelines For Approving Asphalt Shingles In
Wildridge
much as the appraiser says it is worth. The appraiser will
be looking for comparables and if the only comparables
available are asphalt roof products the appraiser will
appraise it less than if they had wood shakes. If your
considering asphalt roofs, then your messing with property
values. The covenants are in force. They cannot be waived,
and they do not go away until 88 years from now. That is fact
and if the overwhelming majority of people who own property
up there want asphalt roofs, seventy-five percent of them
have to say yes to them. Until that happens they are
illegal. He stated that he has a problem with this
situation. The Commission has gone through worksessions and
came to a conclusion which was to be the decision for a long
time. If there is new information, or a new product, or
something that has changed since that conclusion was reached,
talk about it. He stated that one of the reasons that he was
attracted to Wildridge was the covenants. He could count on
minimum development standards. He could count on his
neighbor following the same rules as he did. He feels this
is really a problem.
Rick Pylman gave the Commission a letter from Dave Peel, a
member of the Eagle -Vail design review board, relating how
they handled this type of matter.
Clayton McRory stated that the Commission should get on with
looking at the products under consideration. The applicants
provided all the samples for the Commission's review.
Discussion followed on the policing of the application of the
roofing material to make sure the correct weight and texture
is installed. Discussion followed on the various weights and
textures and warranties of each sample. Discussion followed
on how to define the guideline for the texture and shadow and
relief. Rick Pylman stated that if someone comes in with a
request for an asphalt roof and it is on a house that the
Commission feels has the type of architecture that doesn't
bear an asphalt roof, then the Commission has the right to
say that this would not be an jappropriate mix of materials.
The Commission decided that the final guidelines for approval
of an asphalt roof are: 300 lb. minimum weight product; it
should have a relief and shadow and color variation pattern.
Chairman Perkins then called the meeting back to order. He
stated that he was prepared for a motion on Lot 63, Block 3,
Wildridge, Bruce Kelly Residence.
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
October 1, 1991
Page 11 of 14
Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Subdivision. ,Bruce Kelly Single
Family Residence, Design Revisions•. (cont)
Sue Railton moved to grant final design revisions approval to
Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge, for the color changes requested
and the textured fiberglass shingle, the Oak Ridge Shadow in
the adobe color in a 300 lb minimum weight.
Discussion followed on the color of the asphalt shingle.
Patti Dixon seconded the motion.
The request was denied with a 3 to 3 vote, with John Perkins,
Henry Vest and Derek Pysher voting nay.
A second motion was made by Derek Pysher to separate out and
approve the requested color changes. Sue Railton seconded
and the motion carried unanimously.
John Perkins stated that he voted no on the asphalt shingles
because it is his personal feeling that it is more
appropriate to have a wood roof on a log home.
Lot 57, Block 3. Wildridge Subdivision, Jan Livery (Lod Single
Family Residence. Material Change Request, Design Review
Rick Pylman stated that Jan Livergood received a final design
approval on February 8, 1991. One condition of that approval
was that woodruf shingles be used. The applicant is now
requesting a change from a woodruf shingle to an asphalt
shingle. The applicant will present the exact sample of
roofing material she would like to use. She stated that the
Timberline Ultra has a 40 year warranty, 400 lb. per square
and it has the look of slate. Discussion on the texture and
weight and the type of building it will be installed on
followed.
Jack Hunn stated that he feels that there should be a range
of colors that would be allowed.
Clayton McRory asked if they could add to the guidelines that
were set up that they fall within the same color scheme that
a shake roof may give within a certain amount of years. A
darker brown, etc. To keep a continuity in color throughout.
Sue Railton moved to grant material change request for Lot
57, Block 3, Wildridge. The roof to be used is to be
Timberline Ultra, 40 year, Birchwood color, minimum 300 lb
per square. Clayton MCRory seconded.
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
October 1, 1991
Page 12 of 14
Lot 57, Block 3. Wildridge Subdivision, Jan Livergood Single
Family Residence, Material Change Request. (cont)
Derek Pysher stated that he has a hard time with the controls
and with the product, and he wants to uphold the standards of
the subdivision and make sure that the highest quality
materials are put up there.
Chairman Perkins called for a vote and the motion carried 4
to 2, with Derek Pysher and John Perkins voting nay.
Chairman Perkins stated that they would now go to other
business so that they can go back to the previous request.
Clayton McRory moved to go back to Lot 65, Block 3, Wildridge
for further discussion. Sue Railton seconded, and the motion
carried 5 to 1, with John Perkins voting nay.
Further discussion followed on the color of the proposed roof
and if the applicant would want to change the color of the
proposed roof color the Board would again vote. The
applicant reviewed the reasoning for his choice of adobe
stating that it was to keep it the basic color of a wood
shake roof. He stated that he did not feel that the dark
color that a shake roof turns to is attractive. AS far as
the house being log, if you consider the history of log
homes, most of them had metal roofs, which is also not
allowed in Wildridge. The applicant stated that he would
change the color to a teak color.
Clayton McRory moved to accept the material change for the
Bruce Kelly residence, Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge, with the
teak colored asphalt shingle. Sue Railton seconded. The
request was again denied with a vote of 3 to 3, with John
Perkins, Henry Vest and Derek Pysher voting nay.
Buz Reynolds returned as a voting member of the Commission.
Chairman Perkins asked for any other buisness. Rick Pylman
stated that John Dunham and Tad Degen, representing the Wahl
fourplex project are here to discuss the approved roofing of
this project. He stated that the applicant is more than
willing to use the woodruf product, however there is a
building code problem. On a duplex or a townhouse project
where there is a property line separating units there is a
demand for a greater fire protection. When we first started
using this product, the masonite corporation did manufacture
a chemically treated woodruf, that combined with some metal
fittings gave the class B fire rating that is required for a
duplex or a townhouse project. he stated that he talked to
the masonite corporation today and because of poor market
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
October 1, 1991
Page 13 of 14
Other Business (cont
demand for that product they have stooped makinq that
product. Woodruf no longer has a product that will meet
building code standards for duplexes and townhouses. It
will work in a single family home where you do not have a
property line issue. This project is in construction. They
have a problem with the building code and because of that he
told them that they could come to the meeting with short
notice. They were willing to put the woodruf on, but we
can't let them do that. Their request is to go to an asphalt
shingle. They will go along with what ever is allowed.
John Dunham stated that he got a call on Monday saying that
the product ordered is no longer available. He stated that
they would like to go to a synthetic roof. He provided
colors of the townhomes and stated that they would acquiesce
to whatever color of roof the Commission would wish. They
are about 25% complete without roofs.
Discussion followed on whether this is applicable to duplexes
and if it is what problems will be upcoming. Anyone that
doesn't have a roof on now won't be able to use the product
if there is a property line involved. It could be only on
tri-plexes and up that a type B roof is required.
Considerable discussion followed on this matter.
Jack Hunn suggested that the applicant consider wood shaKes.
which he feels would be a step up instead of down grading.
The applicant stated that they have pre -sold and have to stay
within their limits.
Sue Railton moved to grant Lot 83, Block 1, Wildridge the
change from woodruf to a textured asphalt shingle, in a
darker tone brown, minimum 3001b per square.
Henry Vest seconded. The motion carried 5 to 2 with John
Perkins and Derek Pysher voting nay.
Rick Pylman stated that the Town's Townhouse Project also has
Woodruf as an approved roofing material and they will not be
able to utilize that either. He stated that he is not, at
this time, ready to make a presentation, but they will be
back with a request at a future meeting.
Reading and Approval of Planning and Zoning Commission
Meeting of September 17, 1991
Derek Pysher moved to approve the minutes of the September
17, 1991 meeting as submitted.
Sue Railton seconded and the motion carried unanimously.
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
October 1, 1991
Page 14 of 14
Rick Pylman asked if the Commission had any comments to make
regarding the Streetscape to call him within the next couple
days.
The meeting was adjourned at 9:30 PM.
Respectfully submitted,
Charlette Pascuzzi
Recording Secretary
Commission approval
J. Perkins
S. Railton
C. McRory
A. Reynolds
P. Dixon
H. Vest
D. Pysher
Town of Avon P. O. Boa 975, Avon, CO 81620 (303) 9494280
October 17, 1991
Mr. Bruce Kelly
4192 Spruce Way Apt 102
Vail, CO 81657
RE: Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Subdivision
Color Design Review
Dear Mr. Kelly
Thank you for your presentation to the Planning and Zoning Commission on
October 15, 1991.
The Commission approved the color of the asphalt roof as ,eathered wood, and
also approved the color change for the doors ans windows trim to a Cabot Stain
solid beechwood Grey #0542, and a Cabot Stain Semi -Transparent Dark Grey #0347
for the fascia.
Please do not hesitate to contact this office should you have any questions.
Sincerely,
Charlette Pascuzzi
Recording Secretary
Copy/File
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING
October 15, 1991
Lot 63, Block 3, Yildridge Subdivision, Bruce Kelly Residence
The Commission approved the color of the asphalt roof as weathered wood, and
also approved the color change for the doors and windows trim to a Cabot Stain
solid Beechwood Grey #0542, and a Cabot Stain Semi -transparent Dark Grey #0347
for the fascia.
M E M 0
TO: William D. James, Town Manager
FROM: Rick Pylman, Director of Community Development
DATE: October 3, 1991
RE: Bruce Kelly Appeal of Design Review Decision
At the Planninq and Zoning Commission meeting of October 1, 1991,
Mr. Bruce Kelly requested several material and color changes for
his residence, currently under construction at 4281 Wildridge Road
West. Please refer to the attached memo to the Planning and
Zoning Commission for details.
The Planning and Zoning Commission voted to approve the requested
color changes, but in a 3 - 3 vote denied the request to substitute
asphalt shingles for the previously wood shake roof.
Two of the Commission members voting against the motion to approve
stated that Mr. Kelly had selected a strong architectural style by
building a log home and that an asphalt roof was inappropriate to
that style. The third stated that he felt the Commission should
abide by the Wildridge Covenants which prohibit asphalt shingles.
Box 975, Avon, CO 81620 (303) 9493280
October 4, 1991
Mr. Bruce Kelly
4192 Spruce Way, Apt 102
Vail, CO 81657
RE: Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge
Design Changes Request
Dear Mr. Kelly:
Thank you for your presentation to the Planning and Zoning Commission on
October 1, 1991.
The Commission took the following actions regarding your requests:
The Commission granted approval to the color changes requested, 1. e. changing
the log color from silver oak to almond aspen and the trim to a tan color.
The Commission denied your request for a change of roofing material from cedar
shakes to asphalt shingles.
I realize that you have already filed an appeal with the Town Clerk and are
scheduled to appear before the Town Council on October 8, 1991. I am, however
required to provide you with the procedure for filing an appeal to the Town
Council, as taken from the Planning and Zoning Commission Design Procedures,
Rules and Regulations.
Section 10.00 - Appeal to the Town Council:
10.10 - A decision of the Planning and Zoning Commission may be appealed to the
Town Council by the applicant or any aggrieved person or at the request
of the Mayor at any time before the decision becomes final.
10.20 - Not more than thirty days following the filing of an appeal, the Town
Council shall review the action of the Planning and Zoning Commission.
The Town Council shall, in writing, confirm, modify or reverse the
decision of the Commission within thirty days following the commencement
of review.
October 4, 1991
Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge
Design Changes Request
Page 2
If it deems insufficient information is available to provide the
basis for a sound decision, the Town Council may postpone final
action for not more than thirty additional days. failure of the
Council to act within thirty additional days shall be deemed a granting
of the approval unless the applicant consents to a time extension.
10.30 - Any decision by the Town Council which results in disapproval of the
Planning and Zoning Commission decision shall specifically describe
the reason for disapproval.
Please do not hesitate to contact this office should you have any questions.
Sincerely.
S
Charlette Pascuzzi
Recording Secretary
Copy/file
M E M 0
TO: William D. James, Town Manager
FROM: Rick Pylman, Director of Community Development
DATE: October 3, 1991
RE: Bruce Kelly Appeal of Design Review Decision
At the Planning and Zoning Commission meeting of October 1, 1991,
Mr. Bruce Kelly requested several material and color changes for
his residence, currently under construction at 4281 Wildridge Road
West. Please refer to the attached memo to the Planning and
Zoning Commission for details.
The Planning and Zoning Commission voted to approve the requested
color changes, but in a 3 - 3 vote denied the request to substitute
asphalt shingles for the previously wood shake roof.
Two of the Commission members voting against the motion to approve
stated that Mr. Kelly had selected a strong architectural style by
building a log home and that an asphalt roof was inappropriate to
that style. The third stated that he felt the Commission should
abide by the Wildridge Covenants which prohibit asphalt shingles.
STAFF REPORT TO THE PLANNING AND -40NING COMMISSION
October 1, 1991
Lot 63, Block 3, Wild n dge Subdivision
Bruce Kelly Single Family Residence
Design Revisions
On June 5, 1990, Bruce Kelly received final design approval
for a single family residence. The original approval was for
a two story building with a gable roof. Approved exterior
building materials were 10" diameter peeled and stained logs
(silver oak) with mortar white chinking and window trim,
cedar shake shingles and all foundations covered with wnite
stucco.
On April 2, 1991, the applicant receiveo approval for
architectural changes to the roof form and window/door
placements and also a change in the siting or the buliding to
allow for a shorter access drive to the house.
Mr. Kelly is now requesting the following revisions:
A change from cedar shake shingles to:
1st Alternative: A textured fiberglass shingle,
i.e., (a) Owen Corning "Oakridge Shadow"
(b) Heritage 30 from Tamko
2nd Alternative: A woodruf shingle
The color to be rustic cedar or weathered wood.
The applicant cites fire safety, lifespar, cost efficiency
and long range appearance as his reasoning for this reauesc.
2. Change original silver oak log stain to an a;mono
aspen (lighter colors, and change the «:ndow trim
from mortar white to a blue/green. Tne chlnrsn9 and
stucco will remain white.
The applicant feels the silver oak color was too dark and
didn't leave the natural look and grain of the ogs to snow
through. The almond aspen is a silver color, but much
lighter and doesn't cover the naturalness or the logs.
The window trim needs to be a darker color to give more
contrast with the log color. Samples will be Drought o the
meeting.
STAFF REPORT TO THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION
October 1, 1991
Page 2 of 2
Lot 63, Block 3, Wildridge Subdivision
Bruce Kelly Single Family Residence
Design Revisions
STAFF COMMENTS
It has been the policy of the Planning and Zoning Commission.
in the past, to allow only cedar shake shingles, tile.
woodruf shi-ngles, or sod in the Wild m dge Subdivision.
STAFF RECOMMENDATION
Review and discussion of proposed color and roof material
changes.
RECOMMENDED ACTION
1. Presentation of Application
2. Applicant's Presentation
5. Commission Review
6. Commission Action
Respe fully_--LubmitteQ,
Rick Pylman
Director of Community Development
PLANNING AND ZONING ACTION
Approved as submitted 1 i Approved witn Rec.mmencec
Conditions ( ) Approved with Modified Conditions i
Continued( ) Demed ( ) Withdr
o``
Date
`1Patti Dixon, Secret
With a unanimous vote the Commission granted approval to the
color changes requested, however with a 3 to 3 vote they
denied the request to change the roofing material from wood
shake to asphalt.